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Compiled by
Barry J. Leeming    Digest Prgram by  William McArthur  Canada
Theatre Of Dreams  Banner's  by Sam Hayward   Download the digest program here!
The Devil's Advocate "REDitorial" commentary by Alex Paylor  "RED sky at night UNITED delight!"

The Dennis Viollet Fund

www.red11.org DAILY NEWS
Date: Tues Sep 08  GMT+00:00 1998
Mail: barry@www.red11.org

This Issue:
1. REDitorial : Published: Sept6th 98  "Very Ince-teresting"
2. Fergie Clueless (Carling)
3. The takeover comment by Our Salford Lass
4. The Club That Nearly Went Broke (Independent)
5. At OT (MEN)
6. United Murdoch Fury (Mirror)
7. Capacity to increase / shares


This digest is available Daily at:

Daily RED Trivia  Tuesday 8th September 98:

1951: United beat Stoke City 4-0 at Old Trafford in a Division 1 game watched by
43,660, thanks to goals from Jack Rowley 3 and Stan Pearson. Team was: Allen,
Carey, Redman, Gibson, Chilton, Cockburn, Berry, Pearson, Rowley, Downie,

1964: Pat Dunne made his debut at Everton. Dunne's appearance in the United goal
sparked an unbeaten run of 15 games and he claimed a League Championship medal
in his first season. He made a total of 66 appearances between 1964-66, and won
5 caps for the Republic of Ireland. Dunne joined Plymouth Argyle in February 1967.


Next 4 games: 
Index: http://www.red11.org/mufc/fix9899z.htm

Wed  9/9 Charlton  (H) PL   Wed 16/9 Barcelona (H) CL  
Sat 12/9 Coventry  (H) PL   Sat 20/9 Arsenal   (A) PL

Subject:      list Survey Results + "Sale of Manchester United to BSkyB?" VOTE

Are you For or Against the proposed sale of Manchester United to BSkyB?
Register your vote ..... go to:
For       ?
Against   ?

**INSTANT update on the voting as you register!

Who will be UNITED's leading scorer this season?
Question opened 10:00 EST 31/08/98
Question closed 22:00 EST 06/09/98

Cole            62      48 %
Giggs           17      13 %
Sheringham       2       2 %
Solskjaer        8       6 %
Yorke           39      30 %

Total votes 128

Barry Comment:
So we convincingly agree, 50% of us say Andy will be top scorer for
Manchester United.
Dwight received a massive 30% of the vote before he has even scored his
first goal!
All the others were non-runners. I will be happy if Andy/Dwight score 30
between them :))

Vote now on Skyb, this issue is IMPORTANT!
All the RED best from Barry Bill Paul Sam & Diana at Simplenet!

UNITED Stats v Barcelona are here:
http://www.red11.org/mufc/stats/vsbarcelona.htm Url
http://www.red11.org/mufc/stats/vsbarcelona.xls Excel File


"Media crowds outside OT today!"

Subject: REDitorial : Published: Sept6th 98 "Very Ince-teresting" "Very Ince-teresting" by Alex Paylor So where is the vitriolic campaign directed against Paul Ince? Hey, if David Beckham deserves it, then why not Ince? After all, had England not been reduced to 10 men against Sweden in this past weekend’s Euro 2000 qualifier then maybe they could have come home with at least a draw. But reading the Sunday newspapers and seeing the Ince dismissal receive little more than passing mention makes my blood boil. Don’t get me wrong. I do not want Paul Ince to be the target of the kind of hate campaign of which David Beckham has been the target ever since he was, unjustly in my opinion, sent off against Argentina in the World Cup. No-one deserves that kind of treatment. But, can anyone tell me what the difference is between the two incidents? In fact, to me, what Ince did was far more stupid than Beckham’s act of folly. In the full knowledge he was already on a yellow card, Ince launched a horrendous tackle on Henrik Larsson. Did he expect referee Pierluigi Collina to ignore it? Even the pub league player knows enough to restrain himself when under the cloud of a caution. But so far there has been no cry for Ince’s head, or at least his humiliation. And I doubt there will be. West ham fans won’t talk of brandishing 10,000 red cards in Ince’s face when Liverpool plays at Upton Park this season. Liverpool fans will suffer collective amnesia, and will barrack Beckham while ignoring Ince’s indiscretion. So what’s the difference? We all know the answer to that question. Beckham is a Manchester United player, and as such is fair game for the idiot element, a larger contingent amongst football supporters than most of us would like to admit. Ince is on Liverpool’s books, and since Liverpool have been nowhere near as successful as United this decade, the club’s players aren’t anywhere near as reviled as are United’s. With all due respect to Ince’s wife, Claire, she isn’t a rich and famous celebrity in her own right. Beckham’s fiancée is, and that fact seems to make the couple and their relationship valid targets for some of the most obscene verbal viciousness ever heard at any football ground. Is it fair? Of course not. But it is a fact of life that with success comes envy, and hatred. United players, and fans are used to it. But a situation like this illuminates how unjust it really is. While speaking of England internationals, I wonder just how long it will be before Glenn Hoddle either jumps or is pushed. To my mind, it can’t happen too soon. England will win nothing under Hoddle. When you lose the respect of the players you are done. Ask Wilf McGuinness and Frank O’Farrell, to draw upon the experience of just two managers from United’s past. In Hoddle’s case, he has no-one other than himself to blame. Oh, he will find others to condemn for his situation. But the truth is Hoddle has committed hari kari with the pen, which it has long been said is mightier than the sword. Let’s put it this way. You have a boss who has told everyone he knows about your work habits, and about mistakes you have made in the workplace. Now, you know he has made enough mistakes of his own, but you hear through the grapevine he has managed to place the blame for those mistakes on you and your fellow workers. The question is: Do you ever want to work for this self centered, self righteous sod again? I wouldn’t, and I don’t think most of the England players do either. I believe what goes on behind the scenes should stay there. If a player has a bad half, or game, he usually knows it. That is not to say the manager shouldn’t have a go at him in the dressing room. However, the boss steps out of bounds when he tells anyone willing to listen what was said. To me Hoddle’s original sin, a fitting expression in this case, was his pathetic performance after the Argentina game this past World Cup. He pilloried Beckham, piling the blame for England’s penalty shootout defeat on the young midfielder’s shoulders. Right there he proved to me was incapable of the job. He may have been "telling it like it is" in his mind. But, in my view, he abandoned a talented young player who had been harshly treated by a clown of a referee who was totally out of touch with the match which he was officiating. Hoddle should have stood by his player in his public pronouncements. Instead he threw Beckham to the wolves. By revealing incidents concerning other players of the ‘98 England world Cup side he has done exactly the same to them. You can’t cut players off at the knees, then expect them to run through walls for you. Their attitude and behaviour will change, afraid they will be a chapter in your next literary effort. I recall an incident related in the book "Whose Side Are You On, Ref?" by Norman Burtenshaw which would seem apt to relate here. This former top English referee said he once heard this from a player, in the tunnel before the start of a match. "Right, lads, we’ve heard what the boss wants us to do. Now let’s go out and do the exact opposite." And his teammates laughed. They had no respect for, or belief in their manager. This is the way I believe most England players must now feel about Hoddle. I know another England manager about whom it was said "For God’s Sake, Go!" In Hoddle’s case it just seems so much more appropriate. One last thought about England international players and their books. It took a lot of courage for Tony Adams to write as honestly as he did about his battle with alcoholism. I admire him for that. I hope he continues to win this battle, because every day is a renewal of the struggle for any person addicted to any substance. I pray Adams retains the strength to successfully fight his addiction for the rest of his life. I have similar thoughts for Paul Merson, whose triple addiction put him through much worse pain than any horrors hell could hold. And I pray Paul Gascoigne will finally the face a truth, which seems evident to most observers, although those closest to him deny it. Gazza has a drinking problem. One of the signs of being an alcoholic is when people around you remark on how much you drink, and how often you drink. And since most alcoholics become quite adept at hiding exactly how much they are imbibing, you know when people notice it, there is a real problem. For whatever his agent, hanging on to the gravy train as tightly as he can, says, Gazza shows every sign of being an alcoholic. Instead of the false reassurances of those he drinks with, and of those who make at least part of their living off what Gascoigne earns, he should listen to those who really love him, and care about what happens to him. But most of all, Gascoigne should listen to that voice coming from somewhere inside of himself which says "There is a problem here. Ask for help". I am sure he has heard that voice. I am hopeful someday he will listen to it, for as we all know hearing and listening aren’t always the same thing. ***************************************************************** Comments/Email to: The RED-Devils_Advocate: red_devils_advocate@yahoo.com REDitorial Guestbook Sign http://jupiter.guestworld.tripod.lycos.com/wgb/wgbsign.dbm?owner=reditorial REDitorial Guestbook View http://jupiter.guestworld.tripod.lycos.com/wgb/wgbview.dbm?owner=reditorial N.B. by emailing or adding an entry to our guestbook you are granting us permission to quote you in part or in whole in any future articles. --- The www.red11.org Web Team ---
"Media crowds outside OT today!"

Subject: Fergie Clueless (Carling) Man United 7 Sep 1998 FERGIE ``SURPRISED'' BY TAKEOVER TALKS Manchester United boss Alex Ferguson insists he knowns nothing about BSkyB's talks with the club about a takeover. Ferguson said he had been taken by surprise by the announcement that media mogul Rupert Murdoch's BSkyB and the club were in negotiations. He said: ``It is a PLC matter and therefore there is little I can say about the situation because at this stage there is little I know about it. ``I think the ramifications for the playing side of the club's business will become clearer in the next few days.'' Ferguson acknowledged the talks had worried fans but told the Manchester Evening News: ``Our supporters know full well that I have always considered them to be a major part of this club.''
"Media crowds outside OT today!"

Subject: The takeover comment by Our Salford Lass Date: Mon, 7 Sep 1998 20:19:33 +0200 I've recently spent a lot of time talking with other fans about the changes in the club in recent years and how sad many of us are about those changes - which have fundamentally changed the club I have loved all my life. At the testimonial game last month, I felt I was saying goodbye, not only to the Babes and to Eric Cantona but also to Manchester United Football Club. It was a very sad goodbye, its a love I have had for as long as I can remember. Manchester United is a part of my who I am, my identity, where I come from and the people I grew up with. It is a part of the history of the place in which I was born. In recent years, the club has moved further and further away from that and more and more towards being a world-wide brand name. Some of you may think this is a good thing. For me, and for thousands of other fans who live all over the world (not just in Manchester and Salford) it is definately not a good thing - it's a great loss and for the last few years we have felt like we are slowly losing someone we love. It seems that that slow demise is about to accelerate with the probable purchase of the club by Murdoch. To be honest, I am finding it very difficult to get too worked up about the whole Murdoch affair. This latest development is, in my view, simply the final step in a process which began when we were floated as a limited company. The rot set in a long time ago and is now heading towards its final conclusion. It's now too late to do anything stop it. The "old" Manchester United is dead, we can only wait and see what the "new" one will be like. And as I said to a member of this list recently, we have a choice to make - we can either learn to love (or tolerate) the new ways or we can take our memories, hand back our season ticket/membership cards and visit OT no more. Personally, I can't (won't) let them beat me, so I will doubtless carry on paying my money and moaning about the atmosphere as long as I can - of course if Murdoch moves us to Milton Keynes or raises the prices beyond my means, that may not be for too long. I know some of you will find this difficult to believe, but this morning I envy City fans - they still have what we have lost and I envy them for it. Our Salford Lass
"Media crowds outside OT today!"

Subject: The Club That Nearly Went Broke (Independent) Date: Mon, 7 Sep 1998 20:19:35 +0200 Football - The club that nearly went broke Walk into Old Trafford today and the overwhelming impression is of affluence. A huge ground, a team full of millionaires, it is the football equivalent of Louis XIV's court at Versailles. Yet Manchester United almost never came into being, writes Guy Hodgson. In 1902, Newton Heath Lancashire and Yorkshire Railway FC were broke. The players had pawned their best suits in lieu of wages, the club owed £2,670 and creditors had opened bankruptcy proceedings. If you had to predict a future for the club, it would have been oblivion. Enter John Henry Davies and the true pathfinder to the position where the club today is worth more than £500m. The director of a brewery, how he became aware of the club's plight is wrapped in legend. The dog of Newton Heath's captain, Harry Stafford, is said to have strayed to Davies' home; on its return the subject of football cropped up, and a saviour was found. Davies and Stafford bought the club, changed its name to Manchester United and its team colours from green and gold to red and white and profited to the tune of four players (including Billy Meredith) when local rivals Manchester City were found guilty of making illegal payments and ordered to transfer some of their football staff. The rest is history? Not quite. United, who moved to Old Trafford in 1910, won the Championship in 1907-8 and 1910-11 and the FA Cup in 1909, but by the 1930s their best appeared to be behind them. Promoted from the Second Division in 1936, they went down the following year and up again in 1938 and became known as the yo-yo club. Today's Sunderland would be a good comparison. It was in February 1945, with the ground a bombed-out shell, that greatness finally arrived in the shape of a small Scot. Matt Busby, a half-back with Liverpool, had been offered a coaching job at Anfield but chose instead the manager's job at Old Trafford. The foundation stone of the Theatre of Dreams had been laid.
"Media crowds outside OT today!"

Subject: 67,000 At OT (MEN) SKY'S THE LIMIT! EXCLUSIVE by STUART MATHIESON MANCHESTER United are ready to turn Old Trafford into a 67,000 capacity super stadium by the year 2001, M.E.N. Sport can exclusively reveal today. The Reds today submitted new plans for the Theatre of Dreams to Trafford council which will see around 12,000 new seats in the redeveloped West and East stands. The new proposals, which will not be affected by the stunning revelation that the club is set to be bought out for £575m by BSkyB, will cement Old Trafford as the biggest and finest club stadium in Britain. If the impressive new £30m scheme, to be funded by United, is given the go-ahead by planners then work will begin next summer on adding second tiers to the former Stretford End and Scoreboard End. The current stadium has been bursting at the seams since manager Alex Ferguson steered United to unprecedented success in the 90s despite a £27m project in `95-95 which completely rebuilt the former United Road cantilever stand into the awesome three-tiered North Stand. That colossal structure upped United's ground capacity from 43,000 to 55,300 seats but even that couldn't house the amount of supporters desperately clamouring to get into Old Trafford. Since the North Stand was completed in the spring of `96 the Reds have played to audiences of over 55,000 in every Premiership match.
"Media crowds outside OT today!"

Subject: United Murdoch Fury (Mirror) UNITED MURDOCH BID FURY Stunned fans yesterday staged an angry protest at Old Trafford to condemn Rupert Murdoch's £575million bid to buy Manchester United. "Rupert Murdoch will rape and pillage the club," said Andy Walsh, chairman of Manchester United Independent Supporters' Association. "Anyone who wants to come in and purchase this club, this great club, must speak to the supporters. The problem is that they don't." The media mogul's plans to buy Britain's wealthiest club has sent shockwaves through soccer and threatens the biggest revolution in the game's history. United fans are outraged that the man they've dubbed the "Red Devil" has already negotiated the deal with club chairman Martin Edwards, who is prepared to sell his 14 per cent stake for £80million. Supporters leader Walsh has now urged fans to mount a protest at United's game against Charlton on Wednesday night. However, more than 21,000 United fans who own shares in the club are to be offered a windfall of around £6,000 each, to accept the deal. They can already expect a surge in the share value when the stock market opens today. United shares, which closed at 157.5p on Friday, valuing the club at £412million, are likely to rocket to at least 200p this morning when the deal is confirmed to the Stock Exchange. Walsh has also slammed United supremo Edwards for cashing in on his stake in United. He said: "Rupert Murdoch has no feeling for the game of football. His primary concern is his own personal profit and financial gain. If Martin Edwards is going to sell to Murdoch then he is showing himself to be exactly the same type of character. "Manchester United is not his own personal chattel to sell on to someone else. Martin Edwards doesn't need the £80million. How many swimming pools and Jaguars does the man need? "Manchester United is bigger than Martin Edwards and bigger than Sky." Edwards and wife Sue will not be the only boardroom winners. Club solicitor Maurice Watkins and part-time directors Amer Al Midani and Greg Dyke will also cash in. Mr Watkins stands to make £11.5m while Al Midani should pocket £2.8m and Mr Dyke £180,000. The Football Association will consult with their lawyers early this week to examine the implications to the game if the proposals go through. The sale of England's wealthiest club, floated on the stock market in 1991, to BSkyB could give the broadcasting company a stranglehold on the TV and marketing rights to Premier League football. Though Alex Ferguson's club have a 55,000-seater stadium at Old Trafford, almost all the seats go to season ticket holders.
"Media crowds outside OT today!"

Subject: Capacity to increase / shares Some good financial news for those of you who own shares in MUFC. The share price is up 58p this morning, 36%, to 217p/share. And some good news from the UK teletext WWW pages for those within commuting distance of the Manchester area: =================================================================== UNITED TO INCREASE OLD TRAFFORD CAPACITY Takeover targets Manchester United have announced 30million pound plans to extend Old Trafford by 12,400 seats. The news comes on the day the club confirmed to the Stock Exchange that it is in talks with Rupert Murdoch's BSkyB about a possible takeover. Murdoch is reported to have bid 575 million pounds to secure the biggest prize in English football but the Old Trafford capacity increase will go ahead whether or not the BSkyB bid is successful. United will finance the project from their own funds as well as using "bank facilities." United have submitted a planning application to Trafford Metropolitan Borough Council to extend the East and West stands at a cost of 30million pounds . The club made a statement saying: "The board of Manchester United has noted the recent press speculation regarding the company and confirms that it is in discussions with the British Sky Broadcasting group which may or may not lead to an offer being made for the company." It went on: "A further announcement will be made in due course. Manchester United is being advised by HSBC investment bank." HSBC is one of the biggest banking organisations in the world, and is the parent company of Midland Bank. Murdoch's bid could herald a massive change to the game, as well as television coverage of the country's most popular sport. Steve Rix
"Media crowds outside OT today!"

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