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Barry J. Leeming    Digest Prgram by  William McArthur  Canada
Theatre Of Dreams  Banner's  by Sam Hayward   Download the digest program here!
The Devil's Advocate "REDitorial" commentary by Alex Paylor  "RED sky at night UNITED delight!"

The Dennis Viollet Fund


www.red11.org DAILY NEWS
Date: Mon Oct 05 06:48:11 GMT+00:00 1998
Mail: barry@www.red11.org

This Issue:
1. Statmail 4/10/98
2. Survey results: "Do you think Peter Schmeichel will retire!
3. REDitorial: "No More Dell Hell, Arsene Whinger, and Tunnel Vision"
4. Southampton 0-3 Manchester United:
5. Jones downbeat but not down 
6. Scholes doubtful for England  

++++++=========+++++++========+++++++++========++++++++

Daily RED Trivia  Mon 5th October:

1934: Ronnie Cope born in Crewe. Cope made his debut at Arsenal in September 1956
and became first-choice Centre-half for a time after the Munich Disaster, playing in the
1958 FA Cup final. He made 106 appearances (2 goals) between 1956-61. Luton 
Town paid 10,000 for his services in August 1961.

1977: United beat St Etienne (France) 2-0 at Plymouth in the European Cup Winners
Cup 1st Round 2nd leg watched by 31,634. Goals from Steve Coppell and Stuart
Pearson give the Reds a 3-1 aggregate win. Team was: Stepney, Nicholl, Albiston,
McIlroy, B.Greenhoff, Buchan, Coppell, J.Greenhoff, Pearson (McGrath), Macari, Hill. 

********************************

Next 3 games: 
Result/Fixture Index:
http://www.red11.org/mufc/fix9899z.htm

Sat 17/10 Wimbledon   (H) PL
Wed 21/10 Brondby     (A) CL
Sat 24/10 Derby       (A) PL

UNITED Stats v Southampton are here:
http://www.red11.org/mufc/stats/vswimbledon.htm 

*** PL TEAM RESULTS - MANCHESTER UNITED  ***

Date        Opposition                        Score   Pos.   Attend.
--------------------------------------------------------------------
15/08/98    Leicester City           Home     D  2-2    11    55,052
22/08/98    West Ham United          Away     D  0-0    11    26,039
09/09/98    Charlton Athletic        Home     W  4-1     9    55,147
12/09/98    Coventry City            Home     W  2-0     5    55,193
20/09/98    Arsenal                  Away     L  0-3    10    38,142
24/09/98    Liverpool                Home     W  2-0     3    55,181
03/10/98    Southampton              Away     W  3-0     2    15,251
++++++=========+++++++========+++++++++========++++++++


"Are you Against the BSkyB takeover? Please Read! Click on image!"

Subject: Statmail 4/10/98 *** RESULTS AND ATTENDANCES ON 03/10/98 *** Blackburn Rovers 3-0 West Ham United 25,213 Coventry City 1-2 Aston Villa 23,000 Derby County 0-1 Tottenham Hotspur 30,083 Leeds United 0-1 Leicester City 32,606 Middlesbrough 4-0 Sheffield Wednesday 34,163 Nottingham Forest 0-1 Charlton Athletic 22,661 Southampton 0-3 Manchester United 15,251 Wimbledon 1-2 Everton 16,054 *** RESULTS AND ATTENDANCES ON 04/10/98 *** Arsenal 3-0 Newcastle United 38,102 Liverpool 1-1 Chelsea 44,404 *** LEAGUE TABLE AS AT 04/10/98 *** Pos Team P W D L F A GD Pts --------------------------------------------------------- 1 Aston Villa 8 6 2 0 10 2 8 20 2 Manchester United 7 4 2 1 13 6 7 14 3 Arsenal 8 3 4 1 9 3 6 13 4 Middlesbrough 8 3 3 2 12 8 4 12 5 Chelsea 7 3 3 1 11 8 3 12 6 Liverpool 8 3 3 2 13 10 3 12 7 Derby County 8 3 3 2 6 4 2 12 8 Wimbledon 8 3 3 2 12 11 1 12 9 West Ham United 8 3 3 2 7 8 -1 12 10 Leeds United 8 2 5 1 8 5 3 11 11 Newcastle United 8 3 2 3 13 10 3 11 12 Tottenham Hotspur 8 3 2 3 9 14 -5 11 13 Charlton Athletic 8 2 4 2 12 10 2 10 14 Everton 8 2 4 2 6 6 0 10 15 Leicester City 8 2 3 3 7 8 -1 9 16 Sheffield Wednesday 8 3 0 5 8 9 -1 9 17 Blackburn Rovers 8 2 2 4 8 10 -2 8 18 Nottingham Forest 8 2 1 5 5 10 -5 7 19 Coventry City 8 1 2 5 5 14 -9 5 20 Southampton 8 0 1 7 3 21 -18 1 *** TEAM RESULTS - MANCHESTER UNITED - AS AT 03/10/98 *** Date Opposition Score Pos. Attend. -------------------------------------------------------------------- 15/08/98 Leicester City Home D 2-2 11 55,052 22/08/98 West Ham United Away D 0-0 11 26,039 09/09/98 Charlton Athletic Home W 4-1 9 55,147 12/09/98 Coventry City Home W 2-0 5 55,193 20/09/98 Arsenal Away L 0-3 10 38,142 24/09/98 Liverpool Home W 2-0 3 55,181 03/10/98 Southampton Away W 3-0 2 15,251 *** TEAM RESULTS SUMMARY - MANCHESTER UNITED - AS AT 03/10/98 *** P Won Drawn Lost For Against Points ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Home 4 3 (75%) 1 (25%) 0 (0%) 10 (2.5) 3 (0.8) 10 (2.5) Away 3 1 (33%) 1 (33%) 1 (33%) 3 (1.0) 3 (1.0) 4 (1.3) Total 7 4 (57%) 2 (29%) 1 (14%) 13 (1.9) 6 (0.9) 14 (2.0) Averages per game in (brackets) League position: 2nd Form position: 2nd (Index: 61%) Predicted position: 2nd (The higher the form index, the higher the average league position of the recent opposition) Highest league position: 2nd Lowest league position: 10th (Excluding the first 4 matches) *** TEAM STATISTICS - MANCHESTER UNITED - AS AT 03/10/98 *** AVERAGE HOME ATTENDANCE: 55,143 HIGHEST HOME ATTENDANCE: 12/09/98 - Coventry City (55,193) LOWEST HOME ATTENDANCE: 15/08/98 - Leicester City (55,052) HEAVIEST DEFEAT: 20/09/98 - Arsenal (0-3) BEST HOME WIN: 09/09/98 - Charlton Athletic (4-1) BEST AWAY WIN: 03/10/98 - Southampton (3-0) HEAVIEST AWAY DEFEAT: 20/09/98 - Arsenal (0-3) ------------------------------------------------- *** GENERAL STATISTICS AS AT 03/10/98 *** SEQUENCES --------- LONGEST RUN WITHOUT HOME DEFEAT: Record (4 games) - Aston Villa Chelsea Manchester United Middlesbrough ATTACK/DEFENCE STATISTICS ------------------------- BEST ATTACK (13 goals): Manchester United Newcastle United BEST HOME ATTACK (10 goals): Manchester United ATTENDANCE STATISTICS --------------------- HIGHEST ATTENDANCE (55,193): Manchester United HIGHEST AVERAGE ATTENDANCE (55,143): Manchester United
"Are you Against the BSkyB takeover? Please Read! Click on image!"

Subject: Survey results: "Do you think Peter Schmeichel will retire! Week of Sept 27 Do you think Peter Schmeichel will retire at the end of this season? Yes: 25 21% No: 94 79% Total: 119 Question closed: 22:00 EST 09/29/98 Week of Oct 4 Which trophy is UNITED most likely to win this season? European Cup: F.A. Cup: League Cup: Premiership: Question NOW OPEN Vote here: http://www.red11.org/miva/survey.mv
"Are you Against the BSkyB takeover? Please Read! Click on image!"

Subject: REDitorial: "No More Dell Hell, Arsene Whinger, and Tunnel Vision" Published: Oct 4 98 No More Dell Hell, Arsene Whinger, and Tunnel Vision - by Alex Paylor - After three horrible losses on the trot at the Dell, it was great to see United shake off the Southampton curse on Saturday. It was especially good to see a second consecutive match in which Jesper Blomqvist ably deputized for Ryan Giggs. The Welsh winger's absence, along with those of Schmeichel, Scholes and Johnsen, gave me cause for concern before the kick off, but our squad is finally strong enough to cover such absences. I suppose the assembled media went home disappointed, having seen their hopes dashed of adding another chapter to the "United fall apart at the Dell" saga. And I wondered what the man from the Mirror would make up after watching the Men in Black take apart Davey Jones fish out of water this weekend. After all, telling the truth has never been the Mirror's style, and since the BSKYB takeover bid began, the Mirror has worked overtime on trashing the Old Trafford team. To wit, the Mirror's assertion in Thursday's rag that a Jaap Stam blunder led to the last gasp equalizer by Bayern in Munich last week. Well, unless our new Dutch boy exchanged shirts with Schmeichel, and grew some blond hair in rapid fashion, it was Peter's faux pas which led to Bayern tying it up at the death. But that wouldn't fit with the Mirror's editorial decision to slam Stam at every turn, would it, so their reporter decided to blame the defender to follow the company line. What a waste of trees. Last week I wondered in this space if David Beckham was ever going learn to control his propensity for retaliation. His performance in Munich didn't go any distance toward persuading me he would. A more alert officiating crew would have surely have caught his errant elbow and the media would have had another field day reporting on another Beckham red card. Of course, a more alert officiating crew would have caught the fact at least 2 of the passes in the build-up to Bayern's first goal were offside. But Beckham should be aware that referees all over will have seen him getting away with his flying elbow at Munich, and his inexcusable stamping on Stephen Hughes at Highbury recently, and will be vigilant in future games, and that could spell trouble to come. He will already miss the next Champions League match versus Brondby thanks to the accumulation of two yellow cards and to miss further matches due to indiscipline would be shameful. A Little French Whine. Arsenal's manager is finally finding out what it is like to be at the top. Everybody wants to knock you down. News comes this week of Arsene Wenger's belief that jealous rivals are kicking his club to pieces and referees are less than sympathetic. Wenger's nez is out of joint for a number of reasons, not the least of which is referee Paul Alcock's refusal to even discuss Martin Keown's appeal at being sent off at Sheffield Wednesday last week. He also claims opposing teams try to "do and provoke" his compatriot international Patrick Vieira. And he further claims they're picking on poor little Dennis Bergkamp as well. Now we all know Dennis wouldn't hurt a fly - if he thought anyone was looking. Wenger claims Berkgamp was grabbed by the throat at one time during that infamous match at Sheffield Wednesday, while Nicholas Anelka was sent flying. Good job Berkgamp wasn't sent flying, eh Arsene, because we all know how Dennis feels about flying. Wenger continues "The opposition always physically attack us and we are always getting hounded or our shirts pulled. The second half at Wednesday was appalling." Listen, Mr. Whinger, what is really appalling is your clubs disciplinary record, not just this year but ever since you took charge at Highbury. Last year they were among the worst in the Premier League in terms of yellow and red cards. And this year your lot look like setting new lows in the sportsmanship department. The record reads three sendings off and 19 yellow cards in the first six weeks of this season. These facts obviously mean nothing to the head Gooner though. Before Sunday's game against Newcastle he moaned "We are not a dirty side. When we play Newcastle on Sunday they'll be talking about Ruud Gullit and his sexy football and us playing dirty football." The whining doesn't stop there. Wenger says "We are not getting any protection or understanding from referees. There have been incidents in which other teams have targeted us, and in particular Patrick Vieira. Other players are trying to do him and provoke him because of his temperament. I have spoken to him long and hard about the situation and he knows he has a problem. Patrick has got to learn to be professional." And there's even more. "I know teams are trying twice as hard against us because we are champions and I accept that. But I feel we have not been treated fairly and it is the right moment to speak up. I have seen the Sheffield Wednesday match twice and what they did to Tony Adams at corners was like rugby. We need semi-professional referees and certainly a second official on the pitch." Right on Arsene. Two referees on the field. As if your players don't have trouble enough getting away with dirty play with just one ref out there. Tunnel Tussles. Vierra is being looked at by the disciplinary gods for allegedly pushing a police officer (bright lad isn't he) after the match at Hillsborough. I know there have been many after the match incidents in football but it seems to be becoming a trendy. This weekend alone there were two post match tunnel incidents. Spurs captain Sol Campbell and teammate Colin Calderwood face FA bans after one incident at Derby on Saturday. And there is also the possibility of criminal charges arising from the bust-up in the tunnel at Pride park in which County's Francesco Baiano and two stewards were also involved. Dermot Gallagher was the referee in charge of that game and details of what happened by now have formed part of his match report. Gallagher says he didn't actually see what happened with his own eyes, but security staff reported it to him and told him the police were going to deal with it. Hold on a minute Dermot. If you didn't see it, then how can you possibly include it in your report? In court it would be branded hearsay and thrown out as evidence. If the FA want to know about it then they should request a copy of the police report. It's dangerous to rely on second hand evidence and I would hate to think the FA finds it any more reliable than the courts do. The second incident this past weekend involved Paul Ince and Graeme Le Saux at the end of the Liverpool-Chelsea fixture on Sunday. The two apparently had an angry confrontation in the tunnel at the end of the rough contest. It probably didn't help that the match was officiated by the card happy Graham Poll. 7 players were booked in the match, and Poll refused passionate 'Pool penalty appeals after Karlheinz Riedle went down in the Chelsea penalty area. Now refusing Liverpool a penalty shout at Anfield is dangerous enough. As I said last week, the Anfield penalty is part of the game's folklore, and it is blasphemy to turn down a spot kick claim in front of the Kop. Anyway, as Ince and Le Saux came off the field they apparently had a little discussion about some of the referee's decisions. Being with different teams they agreed to disagree, and rumour has it more than words were exchanged. Poll at least has the grace to admit he didn't see any of what happened in the tunnel so his report will not include any mention of the incident. Take note Mr. Gallagher. So we are now in a two-week hiatus while the England squad prepares for its next European Nations Cup qualifier. No doubt there will be plenty of nonsense come out of the England camp to supply ammunition for next week's Reditorial. With Glen Hoddle still in charge how could it be otherwise? Just a quick note to thank all of those who have written to the Devils Advocate, either through email or through the Guestbook here. Getting feedback makes the writing all the easier, and more pleasurable. So take a few minutes to drop me a line. Your thoughts are always welcome. ***************************************************************** Comments/Email to: The RED-Devils_Advocate red_devils_advocate@yahoo.com Guest Book: Sign http://jupiter.guestworld.tripod.lycos.com/wgb/wgbsign.dbm?owner=reditorial View http://jupiter.guestworld.tripod.lycos.com/wgb/wgbview.dbm?owner=reditorial RED Regards Alex Paylor, Barry and Bill!
"Are you Against the BSkyB takeover? Please Read! Click on image!"

Subject: Southampton 0-3 Manchester United: There's no way I'll march out on the Saints, declares Jones Monday, October 5, 1998 Manchester United had long departed the scene of their plundering victory with three points and a performance that brought three goals, when Southampton manager David Jones stood in the dressing they had just vacated and looked at life from the bottom of the Premiership. Another defeat - just one point so far - and already four adrift at the foot of the table, has left fans openly talking of a return to The Dell of Alan Ball from neighbouring Portsmouth. A series of results that represent the worst start to a season by any club since the Premiership began would be enough to leave Jones stressed out. But after seeing Andy Cole make two goals for Dwight Yorke and Jordi Cruyff, while getting another himself, and Roy Keane bossing games again, he also had to listen to questions concerning his future at the club. Jones gave it to us straight like he wanted to get it off his chest. He said: 'I don't lie, I don't cheat, and I don't belittle people. I try to give an honest opinion. 'Of course, I fall out with players sometimes, but there is no way I will walk out of this club. I may not be an emotional man but I do care. I look at myself every night and wonder if, perhaps, I've run over a black cat or knocked down a nun. 'I don't fear the sack. If I did then I shouldn't be in the hot seat in the first place. Of course, it would hurt my pride to be fired. It means a lot to be managing in the Premiership. 'I speak to the chairman, Rupert Lowe every day. Football is a big part of my life, and I just can't forget about it on a Saturday night. Like everyone else I go away and analyse everything. And I like to think I am strong, positive. I've had a lot of problems in my personal life. They can tend to swamp you if you remain negative. 'I nearly lost two of my children, one through a fairground accident, another with a serious illness. That kind of thing puts life into perspective. My children didn't give up and I won't, so that is my mentality. 'I wouldn't walk away from anything in life. I like it at Southampton. Everything is right bar one thing...winning. 'I have a four-year contract, and I can only give my best. If the board and the chairman don't agree on that I've got to accept it. 'But the wrath of the fans doesn't bother me and being put on the spot wouldn't frighten the chairman either, because he, too, is very positive. I honestly can't put my finger on why things are so different from last season. If the team were not trying it would be different, it would make my job very hard. 'I accept you can get used to losing and we must make sure that doesn't happen.' It was an honest enough appraisal of a situation that may get worse before it gets better. Saints can't score and they can't stop conceding. If David Howells had taken a first-minute chance in the air it might have been different, but United went on to take over the game without even playing particularly well. Alex Ferguson was delighted with the contribution of Keane, combative in his search for the ball, and slowly but surely picking up the pace of the Premiership. It was his midfield influence which swung the game United's way. Once Cole had taken his goal, and Saints lost defender Claus Lundekvam, any resistance appeared to drain away. It remains to be seen how much longer they can exist on fighting qualities alone. When players such as Carlton Palmer are already talking about relegation it demonstrates the difficulties ahead for Jones. In contrast, Ferguson was running around at the final whistle with a smile from ear to ear. United are back in contention at the top of the table, Jesper Blomqvist set up Cole's goal, and Cruyff scored his first for 18 months. Cole appeared sharp and hungry, and it gives Ferguson one more option in his armoury of strikers. He can now afford to rest Yorke if necessary and give Cole a run, or leave Teddy Sheringham on the bench and play his two penetrating little front men. Saints sloped off to applause, more sympathetic than appreciative. It was as if the crowd recognised that at present Southampton are just not good enough. Perhaps Jones knows that. too, and cannot bring himself to admit it.
"Are you Against the BSkyB takeover? Please Read! Click on image!"

Subject: Jones downbeat but not down By Martin Thorpe Monday October 5, 1998 Sitting at the bottom of the Premiership with only one point from eight games has not changed Dave Jones's demeanour. The Southampton manager's face had the same forlorn look when his team were enjoying a run of five wins in seven league matches last season. Even the relative triumph of finishing 12th in the Premiership hardly cracked the Buster Keaton visage. Jones says that the way he looks makes people think he does not care. But underneath he is hurting, and somewhat puzzled. How can a team who were on the up last season suddenly be on their uppers? "Everybody's concerned and baffled," said Jones after Manchester United had ghosted into second place in the table with this ultimately easy victory. "For an hour we were as good as one of the best teams in Europe." Indeed they were. And the game's complexion would have been much different had they taken their chances. But when a team are down, so is their confidence. This was the missing ingredient in front of goal, just as luck, that other fair-weather friend of a struggling team, had deserted Southampton last Mondaywhen a controversial refereeing decision deprived them of a late equaliser at West Ham. Jones can also point the finger at a spate of injuries which have necessitated youngsters being thrown into the fray. On Saturday Claus Lundekvam hobbled off, forcing Carlton Palmer to drop back from midfield which disrupted Southampton's shape. But of course lack of luck, confidence and fit players are not the only reasons for their woes. While one can understand Jones's need to strengthen his squad last summer, and the financial limitations to do so, equally one must seriously wonder how much Premiership mileage is leftin his signings. Stuart Ripley has lost his pace, the slowing Mark Hughes has dropped back to midfield and David Howells is already struggling to command a first-team place. But like Gordon Strachan, Jones has not suddenly become a bad manager. The fact that on Saturday Southampton fought to the end supports Jones's belief that the spirit in the camp is still strong. "All we need is a couple of results," he says, "then the confidence will return." With the next game at Arsenal, the danger is that good results will come too late. Nonetheless, Jones continues to receive the backing of his chairman. "I won't give in to the law of the jungle," insists Rupert Lowe. "He is still a good manager." And the manager remains positive, something he learned after one of his children almost died from illness, and another in a fairground accident. "Those kind of things put life into perspective," he says. So when Jones asserts that results will improve, it is difficult not to share his optimism. "I can't lie to you, I honestly believe I can turn it round." To do that his players must stop missing chances, Saturday's most notable being Howell's early header wide. They must also stop making wrong decisions at vital moments. United took the lead when Lundekvam allowed Dwight Yorke to get in front of him and score his fifth goal since his move from Villa. When Southampton then pushed forward, they left the back-door open. United took full advantage. A great run by Jesper Blomqvist set up Andy Cole for a delicious curler into the top corner, then Jordi Cruyff scored a rare goal after Cole's shot had been parried. With Roy Keane immense in midfield, United shrugged off the disappointments of the midweek draw in Munich, even without the injured Peter Schmeichel, Ryan Giggs and Paul Scholes. But while United missed a return flight that night, Southampton are in danger of missing the boat. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Match stats: Southampton | Manchester United Possession: 45% | 55% Attempts on target: 5 | 5 Attempts off target: 4 | 10 Corners: 6 | 6 Fouls: 14 | 13 Bookings: 1 | 1 Sendings-off: 0 | 0 Football Guardian
"Are you Against the BSkyB takeover? Please Read! Click on image!"

Subject: Scholes doubtful for England Manchester United's Paul Scholes is doubtful for England's Euro 2000 qualifier against Bulgaria after missing their 3-0 win over Southampton. The midfielder will join up with the rest of the squad on Monday but remains a doubt for the clash at Wembley on Saturday with a foot injury. United boss Alex Ferguson said: "I don't know if he will be fit or not. That's up to England, they can assess that for themselves but he wasn't fit enough to play for us." Sheringham tells Sugar to go Former Tottenham star Teddy Sheringham has told Spurs chairman Alan Sugar to walk away from the struggling club and questioned George Graham's appointment. The England striker, now at Manchester United, said: "Spurs will never be great again with him as chairman. He has to go before they have a chance of hitting the big time again. "You can't treat human beings the same as you treat computer chips. "It might be different with George Graham there but I doubt it, he doesn't really know what he is walking into. "He's a Gooner through and through. If things go wrong it could turn nasty."
"Are you Against the BSkyB takeover? Please Read! Click on image!"

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